Cloudflare forces consumers onto higher tiers with threats of shutdowns: Difference between revisions
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==Background== | ==Background== | ||
[[Cloudflare]] is a(n) American based Content Delivery Network (CDN) that focuses on serving content for the world wide web, has taken part in unethical upselling behaviors for their hosting services. Such examples include: | [[Cloudflare]] is a(n) American based Content Delivery Network (CDN) that focuses on serving content for the world wide web, has taken part in unethical upselling behaviors for their hosting services. Such examples include: | ||
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*"Imaginative Pricing" telling users the plan they need to use based on how much there willing to spend<ref>{{Cite web |last=stillicidious |first= |date=2023-11-24 |title=I've seen Cloudflare Enterprise accounts for two clients, the current one is pay... {{!}} Hacker News |url=https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29333160 |url-status=live |access-date=2025-03-31 |website=ycombinator}}</ref> | *"Imaginative Pricing" telling users the plan they need to use based on how much there willing to spend<ref>{{Cite web |last=stillicidious |first= |date=2023-11-24 |title=I've seen Cloudflare Enterprise accounts for two clients, the current one is pay... {{!}} Hacker News |url=https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=29333160 |url-status=live |access-date=2025-03-31 |website=ycombinator}}</ref> | ||
== | ==Shutdown Paying consumer for rejecting enterprise== | ||
Across many incidents involving Cloudflare,{{Citation needed}} their marketing department will extort their users into paying an excessive amount of cash towards their services, giving vague or otherwise untrustworthy reasons.<ref name=":0" /> | Across many incidents involving Cloudflare,{{Citation needed}} used their marketing department will extort their users into paying an excessive amount of cash towards their services, giving vague or otherwise untrustworthy reasons.<ref name=":0" /> | ||
In early 2024, Cloudflare | In early 2024, Cloudflare persistently pitched Enterprise to one such consumer's company to pay $120k up front for an the plan that the business had no desire to pay for.<ref name=":0" /> The decisions pulled by Cloudflare within this entire incident was not handled by a department such as billing or trust and safety, but rather marketing. During the incident, Cloudflare caused considerable unrest and when the business suggested moving to a competitor, they purged all infrastructure for their web services, including DNS records, email infrastructure, and even the website itself.<ref name=":0" /> The user who reported on this claimed that this could have been potentially malicious considering the coincidental timing.<ref name=":0" /> | ||
While this incident was caused by a TOS breach on the end of the consumer and an overuse of resources from said consumer, as the incident poster claims to work for a casino,<ref name=":0" /> Cloudflare's neglect to communicate this breach and a clear reason why they should have been using the enterprise plan, and their haste to push them towards said plan, is a source of concern for consumers. | While this incident was caused by a TOS breach on the end of the consumer and an overuse of resources from said consumer, as the incident poster claims to work for a casino,<ref name=":0" /> Cloudflare's neglect to communicate this breach and a clear reason why they should have been using the enterprise plan, and their haste to push them towards said plan, is a source of concern for consumers. | ||
===Cloudflare's response <!-- Found further responses, need someone to watch these to cover it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KHB2F8R4o8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YcnKfT_ESs -->=== | ===Cloudflare's response<!-- Found further responses, need someone to watch these to cover it. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6KHB2F8R4o8 https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0YcnKfT_ESs -->=== | ||
In a now deleted comment from a [[Cloudflare]] employee preserved by another user, they insulted the user reporting on their incident.<ref>{{Cite web |last=Cloudflare staff |date=May 27, 2024 |title=Cloudflare took down our website - Comments |url=https://open.substack.com/pub/robindev/p/cloudflare-took-down-our-website?utm_campaign=comment-list-share-cta&utm_medium=web&comments=true&commentId=57474314 |access-date=Mar 30, 2025 |website=Robin's Substack}}</ref> Claims included TOS breaches and more, despite a lack of any communication beyond their marketing department.<ref name=":0" /> | In a now deleted comment from a [[Cloudflare]] employee preserved by another user, they insulted the user reporting on their incident.<ref>{{Cite web |last=Cloudflare staff |date=May 27, 2024 |title=Cloudflare took down our website - Comments |url=https://open.substack.com/pub/robindev/p/cloudflare-took-down-our-website?utm_campaign=comment-list-share-cta&utm_medium=web&comments=true&commentId=57474314 |access-date=Mar 30, 2025 |website=Robin's Substack}}</ref> Claims included TOS breaches and more, despite a lack of any communication beyond their marketing department.<ref name=":0" /> | ||
==Consumer response<!-- Need to figure out how to integrate these: https://community.cloudflare.com/t/abusive-practices-reported-by-robin-dev/667477 https://www.reddit.com/r/sales/comments/134u0mq/cloudflare_ceo_publicly_calls_out_sales_team_in/ https://www.reddit.com/r/CloudFlare/comments/1d14zrf/cloudflare_took_down_our_website_after_trying_to/ Also this podcast one, since I am not interested in listening through something just to add it https://www.devshows.dev/podcasts/shop-talk-show/620-cloudflare-hotdrama-auth-and-prototyping-thoughts Feels like clutter but could offer for further reading: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40482106 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40481983 -->== | ==Consumer response<!-- Need to figure out how to integrate these: https://community.cloudflare.com/t/abusive-practices-reported-by-robin-dev/667477 https://www.reddit.com/r/sales/comments/134u0mq/cloudflare_ceo_publicly_calls_out_sales_team_in/ https://www.reddit.com/r/CloudFlare/comments/1d14zrf/cloudflare_took_down_our_website_after_trying_to/ Also this podcast one, since I am not interested in listening through something just to add it https://www.devshows.dev/podcasts/shop-talk-show/620-cloudflare-hotdrama-auth-and-prototyping-thoughts Feels like clutter but could offer for further reading: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40482106 https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=40481983 -->== | ||
This | This overreach has scared consumers into leaving [[Cloudflare]], as the web infrastructure they set up has either been damaged by [[Cloudflare]]'s actions,<ref>{{Cite web |last=malikNF |date=May 31, 2022 |title=Ask HN: Has Cloudflare blocked your domain without explaining what's going on? |url=https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=31573854 |access-date=Mar 30, 2025 |website=ycombinator}}</ref><ref name=":0">{{Cite news |last=Dev |first=Robin |date=May 26, 2024 |title=Cloudflare took down our website after trying to force us to pay 120k$ within 24h |url=https://robindev.substack.com/p/cloudflare-took-down-our-website |access-date=Mar 30, 2025 |work=Robin's Substack}}</ref> or are too wary by these actions to desire further using [[Cloudflare]].<ref>{{Cite web |last=lexx |date=Jan 3, 2023 |title=Ok, Cloudflare I am leaving |url=https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=34235237 |access-date=Mar 30, 2025 |website=ycombinator}}</ref><ref>{{Cite web |last=Gimbel |first=Kevin |date=27 May 2024 |title=RE: Cloudflare took down our website after trying to force us to pay 120k$ within 24h |url=https://kevingimbel.de/blog/re-cloudflare-took-down-our-website-after-trying-to-force-us-to-pay-120k-within-24h |access-date=Apr 2, 2025 |website=kevingimbel.de}}</ref> Both kinds of consumers have both shown outrage towards this incident.<ref>{{Cite web |last=Hacker News |title=Cloudflare took down our website after trying to force us to pay 120k$ within 24h |url=https://app.daily.dev/posts/cloudflare-took-down-our-website-after-trying-to-force-us-to-pay-120k-within-24h-pzxymedke |access-date=Apr 2, 2025 |website=daily.dev}}</ref><ref>{{Cite web |last=Cui |first=Yan |date=May 29, 2024 |title=Tweet from Yan Cui |url=https://x.com/theburningmonk/status/1795720171459645617 |access-date=Apr 2, 2025 |website=X (formerly Twitter)}}</ref><ref>{{Cite web |last=that.map.guy.craig |date=Jun 6, 2024 |title=Comment from that.map.guy.craig |url=https://www.threads.net/@that.map.guy.craig/post/C742TeTP6Kj?hl=en |access-date=Apr 2, 2025 |website=Threads}}</ref><ref>{{Cite web |last=Mia’s Simulacrum |date=May 26, 2024 |title=Post from Mia |url=https://lgbtqia.space/@m/112507693800332501 |access-date=Apr 2, 2025 |website=lgbtqia.space (a Mastodon instance)}}</ref><ref>{{Cite web |last=Bjarnason |first=Baldur |date=27 May 2024 |title=Scumbag versus Scumbag |url=https://www.baldurbjarnason.com/2024/links-18/#scumbag-versus-scumbag |access-date=Apr 2, 2025 |website=baldurbjarnason.com}}</ref> | ||
Despite how sparse it is, some news platforms have also covered this incident.<ref>{{Cite news |last=Matt |first=Milano |date=Jun 4, 2024 |title=Cloudflare Surprises Customer With $120,000 Shakedown |url=https://www.webpronews.com/cloudflare-surprises-customers-with-120000-shakedown/ |access-date=Apr 2, 2025 |work=Web Pro News}}</ref> | Despite how sparse it is, some news platforms have also covered this incident.<ref>{{Cite news |last=Matt |first=Milano |date=Jun 4, 2024 |title=Cloudflare Surprises Customer With $120,000 Shakedown |url=https://www.webpronews.com/cloudflare-surprises-customers-with-120000-shakedown/ |access-date=Apr 2, 2025 |work=Web Pro News}}</ref> | ||