Talk:Artificial intelligence: Difference between revisions

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::::::::The video directory is more of a 'here's a bunch of stuff, some of it will probably be relevant' situation, so it shouldn't be automatically expected that what's on there is in scope. [[User:Keith|Keith]] ([[User talk:Keith|talk]]) 10:09, 17 September 2025 (UTC)

:::::::For the question on Governments, maybe a better way to look at it is a consumer-seller relationship, rather than explicitly a consumer-'company' one. I think any rule that would allow an article about a private utility doing something, but not a public one, would be silly.

:::::::This pulls into the question, though, articles like [[Flock ~~License Plate Readers~~]]. My 'gut feeling' is that this is an article that belongs on the wiki, however I acknowledge that the framework I've constructed would most likely exclude it (which probably means the framework needs adjusting, or clarifying). [[User:Keith|Keith]] ([[User talk:Keith|talk]]) 23:59, 19 September 2025 (UTC)

:::::::This pulls into the question, though, articles like [[Flock license plate readers]]. My 'gut feeling' is that this is an article that belongs on the wiki, however I acknowledge that the framework I've constructed would most likely exclude it (which probably means the framework needs adjusting, or clarifying). [[User:Keith|Keith]] ([[User talk:Keith|talk]]) 23:59, 19 September 2025 (UTC)

:::'''Control of information.''' Access to information is one of the central pillars of right to repair. Since AI radically changes what information people access, I am missing why it is out of scope.

:::AI summaries in search lead to: Loss of independent journalism.[https://www.404media.co/the-medias-pivot-to-ai-is-not-real-and-not-going-to-work/ The Media's Pivot to AI Is Not Real and Not Going to Work] Loss of review sights. Reviews provided by AI regurgitate manufacturer specs, give incorrect information about products, give questionable recommendations.[https://housefresh.com/beware-of-the-google-ai-salesman/ Beware of the Google AI salesman and its cronies] I haven't seen sources on this, but I see no reason why sites that post repair information/fora would be exempted from this widespread pattern.

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[[User:Drakeula|Drakeula]] ([[User talk:Drakeula|talk]]) 18:15, 13 September 2025 (UTC)

==FYI - Moved web scraping section==

There was a large section on web scraping. I moved it to a sub-article ([[Artificial intelligence/training]]) just to make this article easier to manage. I guess there had been a separate article about web scraping, which got deleted recently.

Basically, I don't much want to deal with the web scraping thing (which includes me even trying to figure out if I think it belongs here or should be deleted). This way it is here if we want anything from it later. Please let me know if there is a preferred way to do this. Thanks. [[User:Drakeula|Drakeula]] ([[User talk:Drakeula|talk]]) 01:09, 25 September 2025 (UTC)

==Ways in which AI hurts consumers==

If this article is going to stay, may as well add some noteworthy incidents/sources.

- AI decides who gets health coverage [https://www.afslaw.com/perspectives/health-care-counsel-blog/health-insurers-sued-over-use-artificial-intelligence-deny Health Insurers Sued Over Use of Artificial Intelligence to Deny Medical Claims]

- AI decides who gets loans [https://www.forbes.com/sites/korihale/2021/09/02/ai-bias-caused-80-of-black-mortgage-applicants-to-be-denied/ A.I. Bias Caused 80% Of Black Mortgage Applicants To Be Denied]

- AI decides who gets a job [https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ai-hired-fired-promotion-managers/ AI could determine whether you get hired or fired as more managers rely on the technology at work]

- AI decides how much rent you pay [https://themarkup.org/locked-out/2024/12/02/landlords-are-using-ai-to-raise-rents-and-cities-are-starting-to-push-back Landlords Are Using AI To Raise Rents — and Cities Are Starting To Push Back]

- AI tells a 16 year old how to commit suicide [https://www.cnn.com/2025/08/26/tech/openai-chatgpt-teen-suicide-lawsuit Parents of 16-year-old sue OpenAI, claiming ChatGPT advised on his suicide]

- AI decides who lives and dies as a weapon of mass destruction [https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/03/israel-gaza-ai-database-hamas-airstrikes ‘The machine did it coldly’: Israel used AI to identify 37,000 Hamas targets]

- AI lobbies against regulations for consumer safety [https://issueone.org/articles/as-washington-debates-major-tech-and-ai-policy-changes-big-techs-lobbying-is-relentless/ As Washington Debates Major Tech and AI Policy Changes, Big Tech’s Lobbying is Relentless]

- AI squanders your right to protest [https://www.vice.com/en/article/six-federal-agencies-used-facial-recognition-on-george-floyd-protestors/ Six Federal Agencies Used Facial Recognition On George Floyd Protestors]

- AI blames China to avoid regulation [https://fortune.com/2025/05/08/sam-altman-openai-senate-hearing-testimony-china-ai-regulations/ Sam Altman urges lawmakers against regulations that could ‘slow down’ U.S. in AI race against China]

But sure. They'll cure cancer... eventually. [[User:Beanie Bo|Beanie Bo]] ([[User talk:Beanie Bo|talk]]) 18:30, 4 October 2025 (UTC)

==Data centers?==

I’ve heard mentions of the data centers that the Artificial Intelligence models (generative machines) use cause electricity inflation (in local areas they exist, the price of electricity goes up, as they supposedly do not pay their own bills). Could this be relevant to this topic here? [[User:Aus2004|Aus2004]] ([[User talk:Aus2004|talk]]) 06:15, 22 January 2026 (UTC)

==Unwilling/non-consumer protection?==

Would non-consumers of AI getting negatively impacted by AI products in intrusive ways that should only affect willing participants and users of the product (not to imply that unethical AI practices would be made ethical if they only affected willing AI users) be considered within the scope as far as consumer rights goes?

This could cover stuff like:

- Mass data scraping of internet content regardless of the willingness of its authors to contribute to the training of the AI or the rights to use IP and likenesses of people for the AI company's gain

- AI being used for mass-surveillance, examples including, but not limited to, Flock cameras and Palantir

- The intrusive push for AI use in everyday software products, examples being Gemini being forcibly enabled in Google searches, causing websites in search results to lose traffic, Google tying search crawlers with AI crawlers (basically using the same crawler for both purposes) to force any website to either be scraped or be delisted, YouTube's forced auto-dubbing of videos in different languages and upscaling of Shorts, anything Microsoft is doing with Copilot, etc.

- Control of information, "AI slop", Disinformation (seriously, what is the purpose of trying to make AI videos indistinguishable from the real thing?), etc.

[[User:PixelRunner|PixelRunner]] ([[User talk:PixelRunner|talk]]) 23:59, 5 February 2026 (UTC)

:This would also cover a lot of incidents that @[[User:Beanie Bo|Beanie Bo]] listed, like deciding who gets health coverage, loans, jobs, etc. [[User:PixelRunner|PixelRunner]] ([[User talk:PixelRunner|talk]]) 00:04, 6 February 2026 (UTC)

@@ Line 49: / Line 49: @@
 ::::::::--
 ::::::::The video directory is more of a 'here's a bunch of stuff, some of it will probably be relevant' situation, so it shouldn't be automatically expected that what's on there is in scope. [[User:Keith|Keith]] ([[User talk:Keith|talk]]) 10:09, 17 September 2025 (UTC)
 :::::::For the question on Governments, maybe a better way to look at it is a consumer-seller relationship, rather than explicitly a consumer-'company' one. I think any rule that would allow an article about a private utility doing something, but not a public one, would be silly.
-:::::::This pulls into the question, though, articles like [[Flock License Plate Readers]]. My 'gut feeling' is that this is an article that belongs on the wiki, however I acknowledge that the framework I've constructed would most likely exclude it (which probably means the framework needs adjusting, or clarifying). [[User:Keith|Keith]] ([[User talk:Keith|talk]]) 23:59, 19 September 2025 (UTC)
+:::::::This pulls into the question, though, articles like [[Flock license plate readers]]. My 'gut feeling' is that this is an article that belongs on the wiki, however I acknowledge that the framework I've constructed would most likely exclude it (which probably means the framework needs adjusting, or clarifying). [[User:Keith|Keith]] ([[User talk:Keith|talk]]) 23:59, 19 September 2025 (UTC)
 :::'''Control of information.'''  Access to information is one of the central pillars of right to repair.  Since AI radically changes what information people access, I am missing why it is out of scope.
 :::AI summaries in search lead to:  Loss of independent journalism.[https://www.404media.co/the-medias-pivot-to-ai-is-not-real-and-not-going-to-work/ The Media's Pivot to AI Is Not Real and Not Going to Work]  Loss of review sights.  Reviews provided by AI regurgitate manufacturer specs, give incorrect information about products, give questionable recommendations.[https://housefresh.com/beware-of-the-google-ai-salesman/ Beware of the Google AI salesman and its cronies] I haven't seen sources on this, but I see no reason why sites that post repair information/fora would be exempted from this widespread pattern.
@@ Line 91: / Line 91: @@
 [[User:Drakeula|Drakeula]] ([[User talk:Drakeula|talk]]) 18:15, 13 September 2025 (UTC)
+==FYI - Moved web scraping section==
+There was a large section on web scraping.  I moved it to a sub-article ([[Artificial intelligence/training]]) just to make this article easier to manage.  I guess there had been a separate article about web scraping, which got deleted recently.
+Basically, I don't much want to deal with the web scraping thing (which includes me even trying to figure out if I think it belongs here or should be deleted).  This way it is here if we want anything from it later.  Please let me know if there is a preferred way to do this.  Thanks.  [[User:Drakeula|Drakeula]] ([[User talk:Drakeula|talk]]) 01:09, 25 September 2025 (UTC)
+==Ways in which AI hurts consumers==
+If this article is going to stay, may as well add some noteworthy incidents/sources.
+- AI decides who gets health coverage [https://www.afslaw.com/perspectives/health-care-counsel-blog/health-insurers-sued-over-use-artificial-intelligence-deny Health Insurers Sued Over Use of Artificial Intelligence to Deny Medical Claims]
+-  AI decides who gets loans [https://www.forbes.com/sites/korihale/2021/09/02/ai-bias-caused-80-of-black-mortgage-applicants-to-be-denied/ A.I. Bias Caused 80% Of Black Mortgage Applicants To Be Denied]
+- AI decides who gets a job [https://www.cbsnews.com/news/ai-hired-fired-promotion-managers/ AI could determine whether you get hired or fired as more managers rely on the technology at work]
+- AI decides how much rent you pay [https://themarkup.org/locked-out/2024/12/02/landlords-are-using-ai-to-raise-rents-and-cities-are-starting-to-push-back Landlords Are Using AI To Raise Rents — and Cities Are Starting To Push Back]
+- AI tells a 16 year old how to commit suicide [https://www.cnn.com/2025/08/26/tech/openai-chatgpt-teen-suicide-lawsuit Parents of 16-year-old sue OpenAI, claiming ChatGPT advised on his suicide]
+- AI decides who lives and dies as a weapon of mass destruction [https://www.theguardian.com/world/2024/apr/03/israel-gaza-ai-database-hamas-airstrikes ‘The machine did it coldly’: Israel used AI to identify 37,000 Hamas targets]
+- AI lobbies against regulations for consumer safety [https://issueone.org/articles/as-washington-debates-major-tech-and-ai-policy-changes-big-techs-lobbying-is-relentless/ As Washington Debates Major Tech and AI Policy Changes, Big Tech’s Lobbying is Relentless]
+- AI squanders your right to protest [https://www.vice.com/en/article/six-federal-agencies-used-facial-recognition-on-george-floyd-protestors/ Six Federal Agencies Used Facial Recognition On George Floyd Protestors]
+- AI blames China to avoid regulation [https://fortune.com/2025/05/08/sam-altman-openai-senate-hearing-testimony-china-ai-regulations/ Sam Altman urges lawmakers against regulations that could ‘slow down’ U.S. in AI race against China]
+But sure. They'll cure cancer... eventually. [[User:Beanie Bo|Beanie Bo]] ([[User talk:Beanie Bo|talk]]) 18:30, 4 October 2025 (UTC)
+==Data centers?==
+I’ve heard mentions of the data centers that the Artificial Intelligence models (generative machines) use cause electricity inflation (in local areas they exist, the price of electricity goes up, as they supposedly do not pay their own bills). Could this be relevant to this topic here? [[User:Aus2004|Aus2004]] ([[User talk:Aus2004|talk]]) 06:15, 22 January 2026 (UTC)
+==Unwilling/non-consumer protection?==
+Would non-consumers of AI getting negatively impacted by AI products in intrusive ways that should only affect willing participants and users of the product (not to imply that unethical AI practices would be made ethical if they only affected willing AI users) be considered within the scope as far as consumer rights goes?
+This could cover stuff like:
+- Mass data scraping of internet content regardless of the willingness of its authors to contribute to the training of the AI or the rights to use IP and likenesses of people for the AI company's gain
+- AI being used for mass-surveillance, examples including, but not limited to, Flock cameras and Palantir
+- The intrusive push for AI use in everyday software products, examples being Gemini being forcibly enabled in Google searches, causing websites in search results to lose traffic, Google tying search crawlers with AI crawlers (basically using the same crawler for both purposes) to force any website to either be scraped or be delisted, YouTube's forced auto-dubbing of videos in different languages and upscaling of Shorts, anything Microsoft is doing with Copilot, etc.
+- Control of information, "AI slop", Disinformation (seriously, what is the purpose of trying to make AI videos indistinguishable from the real thing?), etc.
+[[User:PixelRunner|PixelRunner]] ([[User talk:PixelRunner|talk]]) 23:59, 5 February 2026 (UTC)
+:This would also cover a lot of incidents that @[[User:Beanie Bo|Beanie Bo]] listed, like deciding who gets health coverage, loans, jobs, etc. [[User:PixelRunner|PixelRunner]] ([[User talk:PixelRunner|talk]]) 00:04, 6 February 2026 (UTC)