Gun Safe Widespread Deceptive Advertising: Difference between revisions

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{{IncidentCargo

|Company=Liberty Safe, Winchester, Browning, Tractor Supply, Cannon, Remington

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|Type=Deceptive Advertising

|Description="Safes" are not real safes, self-certification, deceptive language, performative security features, exaggerating capacity by technicality, etc.

}}

}}Products referred to as "gun safes" are usually not "true safes" (UL 687)<ref>https://webstore.ansi.org/standards/ul/ul687ed152011?utm_source=chatgpt.com</ref>, but "residential security containers" (UL 1037).<ref>https://webstore.ansi.org/standards/ul/ul1037ed2016</ref> The distinction comes from the certification/rating system established by Underwriter’s Laboratories, an independent testing company.<ref name=":0">https://www.ul.com/services/anti-theft-device-testing-and-certification ([http://web.archive.org/web/20260101184850/https://www.ul.com/services/anti-theft-device-testing-and-certification Archived])</ref> This misleading language is just one of the multiple deceptive advertising practices used in the residential gun safe industry.

~~{{Ph~~-I-~~Int}}~~

==Background==

{{Ph-I-B}}Underwriter's Laboratories certifications available include (in ascending order of security levels): UL RSC Level I, UL RSC Level II, UL TL-15, UL TL-30, and UL TL-30x6. TLTR-variant ratings are also available. UL testing involves one or more people using specific sets of tools to gain physical access to a safe in a certain amount of time.<ref>https://gunsafereviewsguy.com/articles/myths-about-gun-safe-theft-protection/2/#security-ratings ([http://web.archive.org/web/20251117223603/https://gunsafereviewsguy.com/articles/myths-about-gun-safe-theft-protection/2/ Archived])</ref><ref>https://americansecuritysafes.com/testing-process-for-ul-rated-safes/ ([http://web.archive.org/web/20251107123252/https://americansecuritysafes.com/testing-process-for-ul-rated-safes/ Archived])</ref><ref>https://web.archive.org/web/20151029154039/http://ulstandards.ul.com/standard/?id=1037</ref>

Other security ratings may be seen on products such as AmSec's B-Class and C-Class<ref>https://americansecuritysafes.com/burglary-ratings-explained/ ([http://web.archive.org/web/20251006194018/https://americansecuritysafes.com/burglary-ratings-explained/ Archived])</ref>. AmSec claims the standards are set by the "insurance industry" but does not provide links to any published documentation that the consumer could use to verify what B-Class and C-Class actually mean. Additionally, unknown security ratings could be based on factors that do not have bearing in real-life scenarios that the consumer expects their product to perform. (Example: AmSec's product NARCO3824 is B-Class and the product description uses phrases like "it’s extremely difficult to break in or tamper with". However, NARCO3824 is 11 gauge steel which can be cut with handheld tools.<ref>https://youtu.be/NEeS5nCh5e8?si=OZs1R56HNGLp1T5S&t=195 ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=NEeS5nCh5e8 Archived])</ref><ref>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMXa1QImM54&t=134s ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=XMXa1QImM54 Archived])</ref>)

The existence of a "rating" or "standard" does not guarantee a product's performance. The Titanic's lifeboats were "to regulation", yet ~1,500 people still lost their lives. It is up to the consumer to understand what a product's claim actually means, and how that affects the attributes the consumer wants for a product.

== Companies Affected ==

* Liberty Safe

* Cannon Safe

* Browning Safes

* American Security

* Winchester Safes

* Remington ''(is it just Remington? Can not find a website that is not a brand licensee)''

* Stack-On

* Cabela's

==[Incident]==

{{Ph-I-I}}Incidents to expand on:

===[~~Company~~]~~'s response=~~==

*Fire rating (self-certification, fire-safe does not mean heat/steam/firehose safe)

~~{{Ph-I-ComR}}~~

*Performative features (internal hinges, showy linkage, fancy descriptions of bad locks)<ref>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7X8crrn0Kg ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=Y7X8crrn0Kg Archived])</ref>

*Detrimental features (door gaps, handle location, electronics, moisture-absorbing material, etc.)

*Made in America=assembled in America which obfuscates the quality of parts (usually the locks)

*Deceptive gun # capacity

*Detrimental or poor features presented as positives (door handle location, gauge thickness) <ref>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_WCg0KEiyI ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=p_WCg0KEiyI Archived])</ref>

*Containers with security so poor that it cannot withstand a theft attack from a child (amazon desk safes)<ref>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJrSWXFXvlE ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=gJrSWXFXvlE Archived])</ref><br />

ToDo:

*Embed side-by-side snapshots? (snapshot the fire-rating of a product from the company's website, next to a picture of that safe with rusted-out guns inside from surviving a fire)

*Link to the Liberty Safe article on consumerrights.wiki

*Create a guide about how to navigate the above incidents?

==~~Lawsuit~~==

==Key Takeaway==

~~{{Ph~~-~~I-L}}~~

Industry-wide advertising practices mislead the consumer into thinking safes perform better than they actually do.

==Further Reading==

Safe comparison guide/web-guide on physical asset security:

~~==Consumer response==~~

*[https://gunsafereviewsguy.com Honest Gun Safe Reviews]

~~{{Ph-I-ConR}}~~

Videos of people breaking into safes:

*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JmnG9R9S_k

*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_WCg0KEiyI

Related consumerrights.wiki articles:

*[[Liberty Safe]]

*[[Ring]]

==References==

@@ Line 1: / Line 1: @@
+{{Cleanup}}
 {{IncidentCargo
 |Company=Liberty Safe, Winchester, Browning, Tractor Supply, Cannon, Remington
@@ Line 6: / Line 7: @@
 |Type=Deceptive Advertising
 |Description="Safes" are not real safes, self-certification, deceptive language, performative security features, exaggerating capacity by technicality, etc.
-}}
+}}Products referred to as "gun safes" are usually not "true safes" (UL 687)<ref>https://webstore.ansi.org/standards/ul/ul687ed152011?utm_source=chatgpt.com</ref>, but "residential security containers" (UL 1037).<ref>https://webstore.ansi.org/standards/ul/ul1037ed2016</ref> The distinction comes from the certification/rating system established by Underwriter’s Laboratories, an independent testing company.<ref name=":0">https://www.ul.com/services/anti-theft-device-testing-and-certification ([http://web.archive.org/web/20260101184850/https://www.ul.com/services/anti-theft-device-testing-and-certification Archived])</ref> This misleading language is just one of the multiple deceptive advertising practices used in the residential gun safe industry.
-{{Ph-I-Int}}
 ==Background==
-{{Ph-I-B}}
+{{Ph-I-B}}Underwriter's Laboratories certifications available include (in ascending order of security levels):  UL RSC Level I, UL RSC Level II, UL TL-15, UL TL-30, and UL TL-30x6. TLTR-variant ratings are also available. UL testing involves one or more people using specific sets of tools to gain physical access to a safe in a certain amount of time.<ref>https://gunsafereviewsguy.com/articles/myths-about-gun-safe-theft-protection/2/#security-ratings ([http://web.archive.org/web/20251117223603/https://gunsafereviewsguy.com/articles/myths-about-gun-safe-theft-protection/2/ Archived])</ref><ref>https://americansecuritysafes.com/testing-process-for-ul-rated-safes/ ([http://web.archive.org/web/20251107123252/https://americansecuritysafes.com/testing-process-for-ul-rated-safes/ Archived])</ref><ref>https://web.archive.org/web/20151029154039/http://ulstandards.ul.com/standard/?id=1037</ref>
+Other security ratings may be seen on products such as AmSec's B-Class and C-Class<ref>https://americansecuritysafes.com/burglary-ratings-explained/ ([http://web.archive.org/web/20251006194018/https://americansecuritysafes.com/burglary-ratings-explained/ Archived])</ref>. AmSec claims the standards are set by the "insurance industry" but does not provide links to any published documentation that the consumer could use to verify what B-Class and C-Class actually mean. Additionally, unknown security ratings could be based on factors that do not have bearing in real-life scenarios that the consumer expects their product to perform. (Example: AmSec's product NARCO3824 is B-Class and the product description uses phrases like "it’s extremely difficult to break in or tamper with". However, NARCO3824 is 11 gauge steel which can be cut with handheld tools.<ref>https://youtu.be/NEeS5nCh5e8?si=OZs1R56HNGLp1T5S&t=195 ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=NEeS5nCh5e8 Archived])</ref><ref>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XMXa1QImM54&t=134s ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=XMXa1QImM54 Archived])</ref>)
+The existence of a "rating" or "standard" does not guarantee a product's performance. The Titanic's lifeboats were "to regulation", yet ~1,500 people still lost their lives. It is up to the consumer to understand what a product's claim actually means, and how that affects the attributes the consumer wants for a product.
+== Companies Affected ==
+* Liberty Safe
+* Cannon Safe
+* Browning Safes
+* American Security
+* Winchester Safes
+* Remington ''(is it just Remington? Can not find a website that is not a brand licensee)''
+* Stack-On
+* Cabela's
 ==[Incident]==
-{{Ph-I-I}}
+{{Ph-I-I}}Incidents to expand on:
-===[Company]'s response===
+*Fire rating (self-certification, fire-safe does not mean heat/steam/firehose safe)
-{{Ph-I-ComR}}
+*Performative features (internal hinges, showy linkage, fancy descriptions of bad locks)<ref>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Y7X8crrn0Kg ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=Y7X8crrn0Kg Archived])</ref>
+*Detrimental features (door gaps, handle location, electronics, moisture-absorbing material, etc.)
+*Made in America=assembled in America which obfuscates the quality of parts (usually the locks)
+*Deceptive gun # capacity
+*Detrimental or poor features presented as positives (door handle location, gauge thickness) <ref>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_WCg0KEiyI ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=p_WCg0KEiyI Archived])</ref>
+*Containers with security so poor that it cannot withstand a theft attack from a child (amazon desk safes)<ref>https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gJrSWXFXvlE ([https://preservetube.com/watch?v=gJrSWXFXvlE Archived])</ref><br />
+ToDo:
+*Embed side-by-side snapshots? (snapshot the fire-rating of a product from the company's website, next to a picture of that safe with rusted-out guns inside from surviving a fire)
+*Link to the Liberty Safe article on consumerrights.wiki
+*Create a guide about how to navigate the above incidents?
-==Lawsuit==
+==Key Takeaway==
-{{Ph-I-L}}
+Industry-wide advertising practices mislead the consumer into thinking safes perform better than they actually do.
+==Further Reading==
+Safe comparison guide/web-guide on physical asset security:
-==Consumer response==
+*[https://gunsafereviewsguy.com Honest Gun Safe Reviews]
-{{Ph-I-ConR}}
+Videos of people breaking into safes:
+*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=0JmnG9R9S_k
+*https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p_WCg0KEiyI
+Related consumerrights.wiki articles:
+*[[Liberty Safe]]
+*[[Ring]]
 ==References==
 {{reflist}}
 {{Ph-I-C}}